How do I build a staircase?

[Bender]

I need to build a simple staircase. Its got to be sturdy, but not necessarily 'up to code' as its for a semi trailer I bought to use for storage, and maybe an office for me.
The deck is 53" off the ground.

Whats the easiest way to do it? Thanks

[naptownCr]

build it like a deck stair with a landing big enough to swing the doors over it if the trailer has swinging doors.
You can probably figure out how to build the deck part
Check with your local building supply or Home Creepo a lot of them sell pre cut stair stringers which will make your life easier and less explaining to do.

Read this
http://www.scribd.com/doc/6117426/a-guide-to-building-outdoor-stairs

[Silvertree]

Your a painter, just use 5 gallon buckets like the other painters:rolleyes3:

[Leo G]

get a 2 x 12 and cut out the notches, 10" for the run and whatever you need for the height to be correct, between 7 and 8"

[Eieio]

Go to lowes and get some pre cut stringers.

[Blue]

That or they have precast concrete that slide up to it and your done. They are not as heavy as you might think.

[WarriorWithWood]

Comes out to 7 (7 9/16") risers. like Leo said, 10" tread and 7 9/16" rise will put you right at 53" if your using 5/4 decking be sure to subtract the thickness (1") from your first rise.

[Bender]

I stopped into lowes but didn't see any precut.
I'll grab a couple 2x12's.
So, is it as simple as measuring 10", then 7 9/16 then 10" etc. etc?


if your using 5/4 decking be sure to subtract the thickness (1") from your first rise.
Thanks! I would have probably missed that:)

[Eieio]

I stopped into lowes but didn't see any precut.
I'll grab a couple 2x12's.
So, is it as simple as measuring 10", then 7 9/16 then 10" etc. etc?



Thanks! I would have probably missed that:)

They have them,Just ask, the pre cuts are probably less than the 2x12

These are 8 bucks

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=4643-152-4643&detail=&lpage=none

[WarriorWithWood]

So, is it as simple as measuring 10", then 7 9/16 then 10" etc. etc?

Yup, just make sure you look at the framing square right. Either use the outside edge measurements for both rise and run or the inside for rise and run, never mix. (I've seen guys ruin a lot of lumber mixing.)

Other then that it's pretty simple.:2thumbsup:

[WarriorWithWood]

They have them,Just ask, the pre cuts are probably less than the 2x12

These are 8 bucks

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=4643-152-4643&detail=&lpage=none

I've never seen one with 7 treads, always 3 around here.

[Eieio]

This one is 5

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=4654-152-4654&lpage=none

[Bender]

Awesome Thanks. I do ok with that stuff but I figured if I ask I would probably save a tree:grin:

[neolitic]

I stopped into lowes but didn't see any precut.
I'll grab a couple 2x12's.
So, is it as simple as measuring 10", then 7 9/16 then 10" etc. etc?



Thanks! I would have probably missed that:)

Yup, just make sure you look at the framing square right. Either use the outside edge measurements for both rise and run or the inside for rise and run, never mix. (I've seen guys ruin a lot of lumber mixing.)

Other then that it's pretty simple.:2thumbsup:

Cut one and stand it up
for a trial fit.
If it works, use it as a pattern
to mark the rest.
More likely to match, and saves
going through layout all over.

[TulsaRemodeler]

I need to build a simple staircase. It gots to be sturdy, but not necessarily 'up to code' (cheap) as its for a mobile home trailer I bought for me and my wife/sister, and maybe a hangout for me.
I got it set up 53" off the ground with cinder blocks so I look important.

Whats the easiest way to do it? Thanks
I'd just use more cinder block for this, turn em sideways so your feet dont go through the holes.

[Leo G]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home_journal/workshop/4224738.html

[naptownCr]

good find Leo
Better explanation than I found.

[Leo G]

They call me


Googleo

[neolitic]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home_journal/workshop/4224738.html

Was that James Taylor?

[Bender]

Final product:)
That wasn't so hard. Thanks again for the pointers.

[Bender]

I found this trailer on CL for $1500. Its an old jobsite trailer so it already has power and phone, baseboard heat and an AC unit.

We're slowly getting ready to move out to the country and until I can afford to build a real shop this is going to be my temporary shop.

[mikeswoods]

If you haven't already finished the stairs,The Little Blue Book comes with some new framing squares.

It explains cutting stair risers(and roofs).Also there are little brass clamp things that attach to your framing square to help keep you from getting off your numbers as you move your square to the next step.--MIKE--

[mikeswoods]

OOPS,I missed page 2. Nice work!

[Blue]

Good job on your first one. You have one too many though!! You didn't need that top one.

[mikeswoods]

Hey,It's always handy to have an extra step.

Had ladder once that could have used it!

[naptownCr]

Where's the railings
According to the IRC and OSHA there need to be rainings on those steps

[neolitic]

If you haven't already finished the stairs,The Little Blue Book comes with some new framing squares.

It explains cutting stair risers(and roofs).Also there are little brass clamp things that attach to your framing square to help keep you from getting off your numbers as you move your square to the next step.--MIKE--

They're called stair gauges.
Empire makes a set for @ $4-5.

[Bodger]

Good job on your first one. You have one too many though!! You didn't need that top one.


When building decks with stairs, I've always made the top step part of the deck so that I could attach the back of the stair carriage to the rim joist.

I don't think I know how to do it any other way. What do you do? Drop in an additional rim under the rim and attach to that? making the actual rim joist the last riser.

Also, I always mix them up. They are called stringers when you actually cut the rise and run out of the board, and carriages when you cleat or rout for the treads and risers but don't cut the board?

[Bender]

Good job on your first one. You have one too many though!! You didn't need that top one.
Doh!

Comes out to 7 (7 9/16") risers. like Leo said, 10" tread and 7 9/16" rise will put you right at 53" if your using 5/4 decking be sure to subtract the thickness (1") from your first rise.
I did what he told me to do:o

[WarriorWithWood]

Hey, I kept it simple. I could've gotten medieval on yo' ass if I wanted, but it was your first set. K.I.S.S.

[Bender]

Hey, I kept it simple. I could've gotten medieval on yo' ass if I wanted, but it was your first set. K.I.S.S.
Yep. And I appreciate what you said about using just the inside or outside of the square, because sure enough I started using both sides:o:rolleyes3:
Lucky for me I double checked before I cut:2thumbsup:

[Blue]

When building decks with stairs, I've always made the top step part of the deck so that I could attach the back of the stair carriage to the rim joist.

I don't think I know how to do it any other way. What do you do? Drop in an additional rim under the rim and attach to that? making the actual rim joist the last riser.

Also, I always mix them up. They are called stringers when you actually cut the rise and run out of the board, and carriages when you cleat or rout for the treads and risers but don't cut the board?

Yes and yes. You need to bolt on an additional rim.

I am curious as to how you would ever get a handrail on because you are jetting out an extra 11 inches with the unecessary top tread. The rails would not meet the post at the same elevation.

[Blue]

Take a look at the drawing. This is interior of course but it serves the purpose for discussion. Do you have any pics Kevin with your method. I am curious about the handrail attachment.

[Eieio]

When building decks with stairs, I've always made the top step part of the deck so that I could attach the back of the stair carriage to the rim joist.

I don't think I know how to do it any other way. What do you do? Drop in an additional rim under the rim and attach to that? making the actual rim joist the last riser.

Also, I always mix them up. They are called stringers when you actually cut the rise and run out of the board, and carriages when you cleat or rout for the treads and risers but don't cut the board?

I do it the same way.. Blue has got me scratching my head now

[Blue]

This is how i do it except I throw a rim under the rim (not pictured in photo)

[Eieio]

This is how i do it except I throw a rim under the rim (not pictured in photo)

Yeah I don't do it like that.. We include the first step in the stringers

[Blue]

Here is a pick of one of mine. There would be no way of lining up the bottom rails if I did it any other way......... that i could think of anyway.

[neolitic]

This is how i do it except I throw a rim under the rim (not pictured in photo)

I'm with you.
Except mostly I birdsmouth under the
joist if it isn't as deep as the stringer.

[WarriorWithWood]

Here is a pick of one of mine. There would be no way of lining up the bottom rails if I did it any other way......... that i could think of anyway.

I do it the same as you, but I've seen it done both ways, to get the rail to work you need a post bolted to the stringer, or come off of the post level then start the angle at the end of the tread.

[Blue]

I do it the same as you, but I've seen it done both ways, to get the rail to work you need a post bolted to the stringer, or come off of the post level then start the angle at the end of the tread.

that makes sense. nobody bolts on posts here for some reason. theat was the first thing i noticed at CT is that everyone bolts their posts and sits their deck on beams. nobody does either here.

that one of the things i like about the forums is the different ideas you get.

[Bodger]

Take a look at the drawing. This is interior of course but it serves the purpose for discussion. Do you have any pics Kevin with your method. I am curious about the handrail attachment.

I do it the same way.. Blue has got me scratching my head now

I'm confused too Blue.

For instance, if I'm framing a deck that would come off the house 15', and then terminate at three steps to the ground, I stop my joist framing at 14' 1",
and then make the top of the stringer (level with the joists) the last 11" of the deck surface, and then bolt stringers to the last common joist, which in effect, has become a rim joist that I bolt the stringers to.

I'm trying to think how this would affect my railing placement.

EDIT: I just read the rest of the posts in the thread.

If I was adding a set of stairs to an existing deck, then yes, I'd add a rim. But, if I have the luxury of building a new deck or porch from scratch, I incorporate the stringers into the last 11" of the deck surface and bolt to the last joist.

And we bolt most of our railing posts out here as well. And it's all post and beam structural here. Cantilever the last 2' or so of the joists.

[Strat HD]

When building decks with stairs, I've always made the top step part of the deck so that I could attach the back of the stair carriage to the rim joist.

I don't think I know how to do it any other way. What do you do? Drop in an additional rim under the rim and attach to that? making the actual rim joist the last riser.

Also, I always mix them up. They are called stringers when you actually cut the rise and run out of the board, and carriages when you cleat or rout for the treads and risers but don't cut the board?

For decks I use the method where the last step is below the deck with a ledger/rim bolted below the deck rim.

Sometimes in houses I will glue and screw 1\2 plywood or osb to the back of the stringers and glue and screw the top part of the plywood to the rim joist. Meaning, if your stair width is 42" and the rise is 7 1/2 " the plywood would be cut at 42" by 15", also adding for the tread height of course.

Learned this method in Phoenix where framing inspections took place. And have seen it several books. It is MUCH stronger than it sounds. The stairs hang from the rim rather than lean against it. Well, an inch or two of it leans against the rim.

This method also works great when there is no wall under the stairs to hide the additional ledger/rim. I have only seen that a few times though.

[Absolute Basements]

Also, if you birdsmouth the stringer so the end is flush with the back of the bandboard, stringer strap (which is metal with punched holes, also called hanger strap.) can be nailed with hanger nails to the backside of the band and the underside of the stringers. I personally dislike the top tread being the same height as the finished flooring. Darren

[Winchester]

Doh!


I did what he told me to do:o

He said 7 risers, not 7 treads

[naptownCr]

I got to go with the top tread below the deck height. I run a post long on either side of the stairs bolt or nail another rim below the deck rim and bolt the outer stair carriages to the posts.

railings always work out and is easy to do.

the top tread is never an extension of the deck

[Winchester]

We all do it on the left, bodger does what's on the right.

I actually like the middle one but I don't like the idea of notching a joist or girder like that...

http://jself.com/stair/straight/Example.gif

[Winchester]

I was thinkin' about you today :o

http://www.winchesterconstruction.ca/projects/macmillan/prog-05.jpg

http://www.winchesterconstruction.ca/projects/macmillan/prog-06.jpg

[Blue]

I like how you used your hand saw to finish the inside corners.

Grampa said their are a few ways you can tell if you have hired a good carpenter. He said put him on some stairs and if gets his run and rise right and he finishes the cut with a hand saw you got a good one. If you don't have any stairs for him watch how he sharpens his pencil. You'll find out all you need to know from that pencil. (I still haven't fully figured that one out yet!)

[Winchester]

You'll find out all you need to know from that pencil. (I still haven't fully figured that one out yet!)
My only guess on that his how sharp you make your pencil is a measure of your accuracy?

[Absolute Basements]

My only guess on that his how sharp you make your pencil is a measure of your accuracy?

My Dad used to say if he holds his pencil with the point away from him and pushes his knife away from him with the other hand like he is whitttling a point on a stick, he does rougher work than if he cradles the end of the pencil and uses his thumb to push the knife to take smooth shavings off the pencil. I've seen it enough times to not doubt him.
He was a LOT smarter the last few years we worked together than he was when I was in my 20s.
Darren

[Absolute Basements]

Also, around here any overcut past 1/8 inch on your rise and run cuts will fail an inspection. I love to build stairs. A lot of otherwise really good carpenters see stair building as some sort of Jedi magic.
Darren

[neolitic]

I was thinkin' about you today :o

http://www.winchesterconstruction.ca/projects/macmillan/prog-05.jpg



Those are the Empire stair gauges I was talking about earlier! :laugh4:

I like how you used your hand saw to finish the inside corners.

Always!

Grampa said their are a few ways you can tell if you have hired a good carpenter. He said put him on some stairs and if gets his run and rise right and he finishes the cut with a hand saw you got a good one. If you don't have any stairs for him watch how he sharpens his pencil. You'll find out all you need to know from that pencil. (I still haven't fully figured that one out yet!)

Grampa was right!

My Dad used to say if he holds his pencil with the point away from him and pushes his knife away from him with the other hand like he is whitttling a point on a stick, he does rougher work than if he cradles the end of the pencil and uses his thumb to push the knife to take smooth shavings off the pencil. I've seen it enough times to not doubt him.
He was a LOT smarter the last few years we worked together than he was when I was in my 20s.
Darren

Funny how that works......:grin:

[Bender]

Next I'm going to throw together a double helix stairwell so I can get up top:grin:

[Winchester]

Those are the Empire stair gauges I was talking about earlier! :laugh4:
Aren't they great?

a stick of wood and a couple of clamps work just as well though

[Leo G]

My Dad used to say if he holds his pencil with the point away from him and pushes his knife away from him with the other hand like he is whitttling a point on a stick, he does rougher work than if he cradles the end of the pencil and uses his thumb to push the knife to take smooth shavings off the pencil. I've seen it enough times to not doubt him.
He was a LOT smarter the last few years we worked together than he was when I was in my 20s.
Darren

So what the hell am I? First I do it the rough way and then tune it up to get the fine point. Usually I am in the shop and use my crank pencil sharpener.

[Blue]

So what the hell am I? First I do it the rough way and then tune it up to get the fine point. Usually I am in the shop and use my crank pencil sharpener.

I think you would have passed his test about 10 minutes into your first day!:laugh3:

[WarriorWithWood]

So what the hell am I? First I do it the rough way and then tune it up to get the fine point. Usually I am in the shop and use my crank pencil sharpener.

Same here, I'll rough it out then tune it up.

[Winchester]

My Dad used to say if he holds his pencil with the point away from him and pushes his knife away from him with the other hand like he is whitttling a point on a stick, he does rougher work than if he cradles the end of the pencil and uses his thumb to push the knife to take smooth shavings off the pencil. I've seen it enough times to not doubt him.
He was a LOT smarter the last few years we worked together than he was when I was in my 20s.
Darren

:laugh3::laugh3: I wittle mine like a stick. never thought about it before!

Now that I think about it I'm goign to start doing it the other way, I think my pencils would last longer (well, if i don't lose them first).

When things are going well... I usually keep a box of extra-fine sharpies in the van. Right now I'm still catching up on all my bills from a slow few months and that's a luxury I can't afford. :surrender:

http://content.etilize.com/Large/11969501.jpg