Leed projects

[Absolute Basements]

After reading the eco-home mag linked in another post, i'm curious to know if anyone has worked on a project where leed materials were spec'd or even hinted at by customers? Everyone is proclaiming green materials to be the hot trend, but I'm just not seeing it.
Darren

[OGStilts]

I hear what you are saying, to me LEED certification is expensive which doesn't bode well for the current economic environment but I do think people just the awareness of "green" products has gotten more people thinking about energy efficiency. I'm seeing more or being asked more about spray foam insulation, high efficiency furnaces and water heaters, water conservation products, all the way down to light bulbs but when things like insulation cost 3 times as much compared to conventional methods it's a tough sell.

I think when buyers finally start seeing their investment returning more dollars in terms of real tax benefits or better resell values, that's when you will really see the movement take off. That or the cost of these products needs to come down significantly. Projecting a payback of their initial investment 7-10 years from now just doesn't do it for most buyers.

[naptownCr]

Although I do not agreee with all aspects of LEED certification. I do believe in the energy conservation aspect.
The foam insulation mentioned in this thread is a good example.
Agreed it costs maybe 3 times as much as fiberglass bats.
do you know what the R value in a standard wall assembly conventionally framed and insulated with R15 insulation is?
I think you would be lucky to acheive R8 at best.
Why is this?
the installation of batts is not an exact science. there is too much chance for gaps, overly compressed nsulation, lack of insulation behind electrical boxes. compession at wires etc. all of the above reduce the overall U value of the wall.
If a sprayed insulation is used the R value per inch is higher, there are no gaps, airflow is severely cut down. and the wall will acheive an effective u value about 1/2 of batts.
The payback is maybe 7-9 years depending on what part of the country you are in. But lets be serious are we building something with a 10 year lifespan or are we going for a 50=100 year lifespan. As energy gets more and more expensive the payback becomes shorter and shorter.

If you live in an area where most people heat with Natural gas and are not preparing for the future they are in for a rude awakening. NG is extremely cheap right now. When the cap and trade taxes kick in expect to see the cost of fuel to skyrocket. It is only a matter of time.

How much do you think high performance insulation will go for then?

Oh by the way the national association of real estate appraisers claim that a dollar saved in annual utility costs as compared to the average house next door is worth $20-$25 in property value. Add the increase in value into the equation and it becomes a no brainer.

The bigggest thing is contractors not being able to explain the benefits and returns on the investment is the biggest deterrance to sales.

[OGStilts]

I agree with everything Nap said. Gee do you think he has sold a project or two on energy efficiency?

[Eieio]

For the most part LEED projects seem to be mostly commercial work.. Homeowners are doing some energy improvements trying to capture the energy rebates, but it has not taken off the way most companies thought it would.

There are a few companies that specialize in energy efficient products that are doing ok but they have a long way to go to gain a foot hole in the market..

I truly believe homeowners are not that interested in the big picture now.. The cost of going green and the savings/rebates don't add up to enough to make it worth their while.

In the current market with most people trying to scrape up a few dollars to do improvements to their homes "going green" is not really big on their lists.

I think it will be a few more years before we see a major push in this area, the cost of these products have to come down a bit and the benefits of using them will have to be defined or understood better by HO's to make it a viable venture for most contractors to consider offering these products and service..

On top of that most contractors aren't convinced themselves about the benefits of using these products.. Hard to sell some thing that does not have a demand and your not convinced of their benefits as well

[topcoat]

We completed one leed project this year. It was our second one. It was not as well administered as they are supposed to be. Usually there is a leed certified person assigned to the project to help with compliance. In this case, there wasnt. It was compounded by the fact that the homeowner is an environmental attorney with a wife and newborn baby. So he was very serious about achieving the certification. It created alot of legwork for me in terms of researching exactly which products are compliant. Its a good thing I did. There are many low voc products that you would think to be no brainers for meeting the criteria that have not yet been approved. If you get into a leed project, make sure you know what you can use. You dont want to be the one responsible for your part of the deal not getting its leed credit.